Re: [dq-rules] Digest Number 153

["john franklin" <johncfranklin@hotmail.com>]

> > > Message: 3
   Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 07:58:50 -0700 (PDT)
   From: Rodger Thorm <rodger_thorm@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Let's have a war!

I also think that there is a strong candidate from
SPI's own stable of games.  A few years back, I
discovered SPI's PRESTAGS (PRE-Seventeenth-century
TActical Game System), which probably would've been
adapted for use as DQ's mass-combat system, had the
company stayed in business.  There are several
features in the game that value leaders and leadership
that would seem to be an easy fit with, and extension
of, Military Scientist rules.

SPI also used PRESTAGS as the base rule-set for their
famous Lord of the Rings game.  I have never
personally looked at a copy of that, so I don't know
what additional rules they incorporated to deal with
heroes and magic.

  --Rodger Thorm

Prestags Materpack was the first SPI game I ever bought. The combat system 
was very simple, sort of the basic SPI engine of 1-1, 2-1, 3-1, with results 
tapered by one for each column; modifications came depending on which class 
of unit was fighting which--for example, sword/axe tpyes (class B) were 
double strength against spear/pike types (Class A) (hence the Romans defeat 
the successors of Alexander), while cavalry (Class C) were double against 
swoards/axes, but half against spears. Sort of Rock, Scissors, Paper.

The real value of the five-game set is in the comprehensive scenario list 
which covers all the famous battles of antiquity, and the massive amount of 
counters of all different unit types from ancient Near Eastern chariots to 
Viking axemen and ships, to early gunpowder weapons. You could use these, 
and the very generic terrain maps, to do all sorts of fantasy battles in a 
RPG. THe leader rules are very basic, I think a leader simply adds one or 
two points to a die roll, or shifts the odds one column. But you might 
perhaps incorporate  something more complex, like the command-radius rules 
of games like Napoleon's Last Battles. Again, SPI provided great hardware, 
and you could use it to design your own games.

I only used this a few times in my DQ game. I think I had the characters 
assigned to a specific unit counter. YOu could make them a leader too, or 
just a regular soldier. Then the GM plays the prestags battle against the 
player (if the player is also a leader, it is more realistic). Then, anytime 
the player's unit is involved in a conflict, I played out a multi-figure 
combat according to DQ rules. The number of opponents, their armament, 
positioning, and all that, depended on the prestags situation. So, if the 
player is in a company of roman style legionaries that are taken in the 
flank by a bunch a light cavalry and overwhelmed, you throw a bunch of enemy 
figures at him on horse w a surprise initiative.

The prestags units and their graphics did feature in the War of the Ring 
game system--one of SPIs masterpieces, and always fun and interesting no 
matter how many dozens of times you play it. The leader system was a plus to 
the die roll, depending on morale of character. there was also a separate 
individual combat system for character vs character based on strength, 
morale, magic, magic resistance, and magic items. It may have been similar 
to that used in Swords and Sorcery, if I rememebr correctly (another 
brilliant game, also using the prestags unit graphics).

john franklin

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