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61 |
From: Richard <demon_star2002@y...>
Date: Fri Jun 13, 2003 3:41pm
Subject:
Re: David's Draft Rules
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--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
<david.barrass@e...> wrote:
> > Do you mean the GM should have the priests god
punish the priest
or
> > do you mean suggest that the GM punish the player (I
assume
through
> > exp)?
>
> Why not both?
Here's why not-
1) If I read the phrase "heavily punished", I would
rather pass on
being a Priest in favor of being a Mage. You set up a
bit of an
adversarial postion between GM and player here, one
where the player
is constantly having to worry about fucking up and
incuring the wrath
of the GM/god.
2) It would throw off the balance (yet to be
determined), between the
powers available to the Priest and the relative ease
with which they
gain those powers.
3) Kind of a hollow threat depending on how difficult it
would be to
stay within the doctrines of the church. Remember that
the player
would be accepting the role with full knowledge of what
was expected
of him. If he had a problem with that, then why play
that Priest?
Try:-
>
> [101.2] Priests must at all times be acting in
accordance with the
> principles of the Religion
> Priests who fail to live up to he high standards of a
religion or
> break its rules will be heavily punished. The
punishments (in
order
> of severity) will include, but is not limited to:-
> Reduced EXP awards by the GM
> Loss of status within the religious organisation
> Prevented from advancing in ranks
> Loss of ranks in religious abilities
> Loss of all ranks of religious abilities
> Loss of all ranks of religious abilities and initiate
status
> Curses from the Religious organisation and/or the
deity
> Some of these can be restored by the performance of an
act of
penance
> or heroic act that is commensurate with the original
offence
>
> > scratching her head. Actually, I'm not really sure
what "WP skill
> > ranks" means, myself.
>
> err - yes what DID I mean?
> Ok try
> They are intelligent as they were when alive and may
retain a
number
> of spells up to their current MA. They may only have a
total
number
> of ranks in all of their skills equivalent to their
current WP.
They
> may not improve skill or spell ranks.
Works for me. :)
> I've been debating with myself the need for a Pagan
priest skill
and
> tying it into the magical abilities, and I'm currently
on the side
of
> having one
Likewise. My thinking is that the Priest skill should
cover
the "clerical" (as in clerk) aspect of priesthood. Any
priesthood,
whether it be Pagan or Divine. That reminds me of a fave
Simpsons
quote Rev. Lovejoy: "...be he Christian, Jew, or
miscellaneous." To
which Apu responds (to the "misc." bit): "There are over
80 Million
of us, you know." It is to laugh. If you haven't already
done it, go
read the Priest skill I posted in this group (it's one
of the first
ones) and take a close look at the "gathering followers"
stuff. It's
crude, but it addresses an important part of religion.
> I feel it should be separate. It is powered by the
beleif and
> reverence of believers as a spirit, not like an
undead. It is
> therefore far more influenced by what people believe
of it than an
> undead.
Understood. If you haven't included this in your write
up, I'd
recommend it. If it's a point that got past me, it can
get past
others as well.
> > etc. "Land of Faerie", for instance, has a nice ring
to it.
>
> Yes I've noticed that I started out I called them
Worlds -
Physical,
> Spirit World etc. When I've come back to it I've
started to use
> plains. I think I'll move away from planes
You might want to mix it up. "Spirit World" works well,
"Faerie
World" on the other hand... (maybe that just sounds off
to Americans.
lol)
Okay, looks like were getting some work done here! Woo!
Later,
R.
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62 |
From: Richard <demon_star2002@y...>
Date: Fri Jun 13, 2003 4:50pm
Subject:
Notice to list members
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Make note of the changes in the group description at
the top of the
page. I hadn't taken into consideration that Barras
might not want
his work bandied about, so you'll need to ask permission
to swipe his
stuff from him.
Just seemed like a good idea.
Later,
R.
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63 |
From: Richard <demon_star2002@y...>
Date: Fri Jun 13, 2003 5:08pm
Subject:
Re: The Light and Darkness War II
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Hey, I'm a Penitente- self-flagellation is a big
part of my life. ;P
Later,
R.
--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com, John Rauchert
<john.rauchert@s...> wrote:
> Hey Richard,
>
>
>
> We are trying to run a family friendly "satanic"
roleplaying game
forum
> here.
>
>
>
> If this public self abuse continues we may have to
take stiffer
action.
>
>
>
> :-)
>
>
>
> JohnR.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Richard [mailto:demon_star2002@y...]
> Sent: Friday, June 13, 2003 3:06 PM
> To:
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [DragonQuestCathedral] Re: The Light and
Darkness War II
>
>
>
> --- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com, "Richard"
> <demon_star2002@y...> wrote:
>
> > I might suggest that the "Greater Powers" mentioned
in the
> Astrologer
> > skill are, in fact, pagan or "magical" gods. Waddaya
think o'
that?
> > Hm? Eh?
>
> This is utter shit and you are clearly an idiot. If
you'd have
> actually read the book, you would know that they are
speaking of
> celestial bodies and nothing more, you retard.
> >
> > Okay, that's it from me for now- my ass hurts.
>
> My ass would hurt, too, if that's where *my* brains
were.
>
>
> Later,
> R.
>
>
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64 |
From: dbarrass_2000 <david.barrass@e...>
Date: Tue Jun 17, 2003 1:36am
Subject:
Re: The Light and Darkness War II
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--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com, "Richard"
<demon_star2002@y...> wrote:
> --- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com, "Richard"
> <demon_star2002@y...> wrote:
>
> > I might suggest that the "Greater Powers" mentioned
in the
> Astrologer
> > skill are, in fact, pagan or "magical" gods. Waddaya
think o'
that?
> > Hm? Eh?
>
> This is utter shit and you are clearly an idiot. If
you'd have
> actually read the book, you would know that they are
speaking of
> celestial bodies and nothing more, you retard.
> >
> > Okay, that's it from me for now- my ass hurts.
>
> My ass would hurt, too, if that's where *my* brains
were.
Don't be so hard on yourself, certainly the Romans
identified their
gods with celestial bodies; Mars, Venus, Mercury etc. I
thought the
rest of it made a lot of sense too.
David
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65 |
From: dbarrass_2000 <david.barrass@e...>
Date: Tue Jun 17, 2003 4:12am
Subject:
Re: David's Draft Rules
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--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com, "Richard"
<demon_star2002@y...> wrote:
> --- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
> <david.barrass@e...> wrote:
> > > Do you mean the GM should have the priests god
punish the
priest
> or
> > > do you mean suggest that the GM punish the player
(I assume
> through
> > > exp)?
> >
> > Why not both?
>
> Here's why not-
>
> 1) If I read the phrase "heavily punished", I would
rather pass on
> being a Priest in favor of being a Mage. You set up a
bit of an
> adversarial postion between GM and player here, one
where the
player
> is constantly having to worry about fucking up and
incuring the
wrath
> of the GM/god.
>
> 2) It would throw off the balance (yet to be
determined), between
the
> powers available to the Priest and the relative ease
with which
they
> gain those powers.
I envision several advantages to being a priest
1) gaining spells with a lower MA
2) one cheap skill appropriate to the worship of the God
3) Ease of training in abillities, any temple can train
priests to
some degree with little payment
4) Social acceptabillity. Many socities will regard
mages with
suspicion but will accept certain priests
> 3) Kind of a hollow threat depending on how difficult
it would be
to
> stay within the doctrines of the church. Remember that
the player
> would be accepting the role with full knowledge of
what was
expected
> of him. If he had a problem with that, then why play
that Priest?
I agree, ifI were GMing I take the line that if someone
refuses to
Role-play then the ultimate loser is the player. But I
feel the
sanctions should be there so the player knows what could
happen
> Try:-
> >
> > [101.2] Priests must at all times be acting in
accordance with
the
> > principles of the Religion
> > Priests who fail to live up to he high standards of
a religion or
> > break its rules will be heavily punished. The
punishments (in
> order
> > of severity) will include, but is not limited to:-
> > Reduced EXP awards by the GM
> > Loss of status within the religious organisation
> > Prevented from advancing in ranks
> > Loss of ranks in religious abilities
> > Loss of all ranks of religious abilities
> > Loss of all ranks of religious abilities and
initiate status
> > Curses from the Religious organisation and/or the
deity
> > Some of these can be restored by the performance of
an act of
> penance
> > or heroic act that is commensurate with the original
offence
> >
snip
>
> > I've been debating with myself the need for a Pagan
priest skill
> and
> > tying it into the magical abilities, and I'm
currently on the
side
> of
> > having one
>
> Likewise. My thinking is that the Priest skill should
cover
> the "clerical" (as in clerk) aspect of priesthood. Any
priesthood,
> whether it be Pagan or Divine. That reminds me of a
fave Simpsons
> quote Rev. Lovejoy: "...be he Christian, Jew, or
miscellaneous." To
> which Apu responds (to the "misc." bit): "There are
over 80 Million
> of us, you know." It is to laugh. If you haven't
already done it,
go
> read the Priest skill I posted in this group (it's one
of the first
> ones) and take a close look at the "gathering
followers" stuff.
It's
> crude, but it addresses an important part of religion.
A priest should also be able to preach to influence a
crowd
Sounds like a new thread
> Okay, looks like were getting some work done here!
Woo!
>
Yes we are.
David
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66 |
From: Richard <demon_star2002@y...>
Date: Wed Jun 18, 2003 9:37am
Subject:
Re: The Light and Darkness War II
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|
|
--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
> Don't be so hard on yourself, certainly the Romans
identified their
> gods with celestial bodies; Mars, Venus, Mercury etc.
I thought
the
> rest of it made a lot of sense too.
>
> David
Sorry, that's just my peculiar sense of humor at work
there. Just had
to kick myself for, once again, putting the cart before
the horse...
something like that.
Okay, how do you see the Great Powers fitting into the
Big Picture
where mythoi are concerned?
Later,
R.
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67 |
From: Richard <demon_star2002@y...>
Date: Wed Jun 18, 2003 9:56am
Subject:
Re: David's Draft Rules
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|
|
--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
<david.barrass@e...> wrote:
> I envision several advantages to being a priest
> 1) gaining spells with a lower MA
I agree. I don't think MA should even be an issue here.
> 2) one cheap skill appropriate to the worship of the
God
Did that. See below.
> 3) Ease of training in abillities, any temple can
train priests to
> some degree with little payment
Low exp cost?
> 4) Social acceptabillity. Many socities will regard
mages with
> suspicion but will accept certain priests
Does this address the old POL vs. Magic issue?
> > of us, you know." It is to laugh. If you haven't
already done it,
> go
> > read the Priest skill I posted in this group (it's
one of the
first
> > ones) and take a close look at the "gathering
followers" stuff.
> It's
> > crude, but it addresses an important part of
religion.
>
> A priest should also be able to preach to influence a
crowd
Been there, done that-
[ .5] A PRIEST CAN INFLUENCE THE THOUGHTS OF HIS
FOLLOWERS.
A priest can perform a sermon to influence those that
follow
his religion. If more than FIVE people attend his
sermon, only (50+
[5%/Rank]%) people will stay to listen. For those that
stay 10%
(+5%/Rank) can be converted. The chance for a priest to
convert a
follower is (WP+[2%/Rank]%)
I don't know if you've actually looked at it yet (and if
you haven't,
shame on you), but my Priest skill, if nothing else,
covers all the
functions of a priest in as generic way as possible.
Everything that
follows the header (the mechanics and such) are
admittedly shaky, but
I think the headers, themselves, hold up pretty well.
Later,
R.
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68 |
From: dbarrass_2000 <david.barrass@e...>
Date: Thu Jun 19, 2003 2:20am
Subject:
Re: Priest skill
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OK I'm taking this from the point of view of a
Priest of a Pagan (for
want of a better word, but anyway as opposed to PoL)
religion
--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com, "Richard"
<demon_star2002@y...> wrote:
> I wrote this sometime back in the late 80's if memory
serves and
has
> remained untouched all these years. I present it to
you now as is,
> warts and all. It's not perfect, by any means, but I
do think there
> are some useable nuggets in there somewhere.
>
> PRIEST
> [ .1] A PRIEST CAN REQUEST INFORMATION, PHYSICAL
ASSISTANCE, OR
> PROTECTION THROUGH INTENSIVE PRAYER. SOMETIMES THE
ASSISTANCE MAY
> COME IN THE FORM OF A SPELL, COUNTERSPELL, TALENT,
RITUAL OR SKILL
> PARTICULAR TO THAT DEITY. THE NUMBER OF TIMES MAY BE
DONE IS
LIMITED
> TO THE PRIESTS RANK.
> A priest must spend ONE HOUR (-5 minutes/RANK) in
intensive
> prayer to gain his deity's assistance. The RANK of the
spell,
talent,
> ritual, or skill is equal to the rank of the priest.
The spell
> effects of double and triple effect, backfire and
broken
> concentration (SEE 29.5, 30, 28.2. (SEE ALSO 29), MANA
and COLD
IRON
> do not effect this ability.
Payer and spells I think I've covered Interesting
philosophical point
here, that I think Pagan uses the priests own magic
abillity and
there for MA and cold iron do affect the performance
(not for PoL)
> [ .2] A PRIEST IS REQUIRED TO PAY TRIBUTE TO HIS DEITY
A NUMBER OF
> TIMES A MONTH AS DICTATED BY THAT PARTICULAR RELIGION.
> Failure to perform this function will result in a -15%
penalty
> to all rols of this skill. The priest must then atone
(SEE ) for
his
> indiscretion.
That's a good idea works for PoL too.
> [ .3] A PRIEST IS REQUIRED TO DEVOTE A CERTAIN AMOUNT
OF TIME TO
> STUDYING THE DOCTRINES OF HIS RELIGION.
> A priest cannot atain the next rank until he has
devoted the
> appropriate amount of time required.
Another good idea (PoL also)
> [ .4] A PRIESTS BASE CHANCE OF SUCCESS FOR ALL ROLLS
INCREASES AS
HE
> GAINS FOLLOWERS.
> The priest recieves +1%/4 followers he converts to all
rolls.
Interesting idea, one I have problems with, but I'm not
sure my
objections are justified. I've been thinking about this
for some
time and I'm still not sure. Who's followers are they,
the priest's
of the God's? How does this fit in with DQ mechanics?
But yes the
diety will want to reward a successful priest. How about
20 (or
something like that, Exps reward from the Deity for each
sentient
initiated as a reward (that brings up problems of what
happend if the
sentient decides he was wrong and leaves
> [ .5] A PRIEST CAN INFLUENCE THE THOUGHTS OF HIS
FOLLOWERS.
> A priest can perform a sermon to influence those that
follow
> his religion. If more than FIVE people attend his
sermon, only (50+
> [5%/Rank]%) people will stay to listen. For those that
stay 10%
> (+5%/Rank) can be converted. The chance for a priest
to convert a
> follower is (WP+[2%/Rank]%)
I was going to use the rules in Troubadour Bardic Voice
to charm, it
has already been worked out
> [ .6] A PRIESTS BASE CHANCE OF SUCCESS DECREASES WHEN
HE PERFORMS
> ACTIONS CONTRARY TO THE DOCTRINES OF HIS RELIGION.
> A priest recieves a -15% penalty to all his rolls for
this
> skill. The priest must then atone for his
indiscretion.
We've been into this in other posts
> [ .7] AT RANK 5 A PRIEST MAY "LAY ON HANDS" AND HEAL
FOLLOWERS OF
HIS
> OWN RELIGION.
> The priest performs this "laying on of hands" as a
Rank 3
> Healer. All rules for this apply. See [59.1]
No - sorry. This is not appropriate for, say, a priest
of an evil or
death god. I would suggest paying 3/4 exp cost for an
appropriate
skill (if there is one) instead. This will be healling
for some gods
> [ .9] A PRIEST MAY BE REQUIRED TO PERFORM A SACRIFICE
FOR HIS DEITY.
> Failure to do so gives the priest a -15% penalty as [
.6]
> above, as well as the required atonement.
OK, but its a bit sketchy
> [ .10] A PRIEST MUST SPEND (500x[Rank+number of
followers]) PER
YEAR
> FOR UPKEEP OF THE TEMPLE, AND THE TRAPPINGS AND
ACCOUTRAMENTS
> APPROPRIATE TO THE RELIGION. IF NO TEMPLE EXISTS, THE
COST IS(100x
> [Rank+number of followers] PER YEAR.
OK that works, but for some points
1) I think its too expensive
2) Its cheaper not to have a temple, so why would you
want a temple?
What are the advantages of a temple?
3) You should be able to generate money from your
followers.
Perhaps the last point contains the solution to the
others, If you
have a temple you get more donations from your followers
and you
attract more followers
> EXPERIENCE POINT COST CHART
> 0 | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10
> 75
|400|1600|3500|5800|8400|11400|14700|18500|22500|26750
It seems expensive for what you get, especially if you
have to pay
Exps for magical abillities, as you would in my version.
How about tieing increase in ranks to gaining
abillities, Rank 0
tallents only, Rank 1 General Knowledge Abillities, Rank
3 Can start
to learn the Special Knowledge.
This is my take on the skill as adapted to fit my
system. I hope I
haven't destroyed you vision
David
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69 |
From: dbarrass_2000 <david.barrass@e...>
Date: Thu Jun 19, 2003 2:29am
Subject:
Re: David's Draft Rules
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|
|
--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com, "Richard"
<demon_star2002@y...> wrote:
> --- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
> <david.barrass@e...> wrote:
> > I envision several advantages to being a priest
> > 1) gaining spells with a lower MA
>
> I agree. I don't think MA should even be an issue
here.
Ah, I do. As I've said the Priest uses his magic in the
name of the
god. He therefore requires an MA to access the magic,
But the God
makes it easier
> Does this address the old POL vs. Magic issue?
No, I was thinking of social acceptabillity between
Pagan religion
and Magic. A big plus of a religion is that it allows
access to
magic but with an acceptable moral face and code.
Therefore in many
societies mages will be seen as dangerous wild cards,
but a priest
with the same abillities will be seen as a pillar of
society, he is
more accountable. This is, of course culturally
dependant, and will
not be true of all a GM's nations and races.
> > > of us, you know." It is to laugh. If you haven't
already done
it,
> > go
> > > read the Priest skill I posted in this group (it's
one of the
> first
> > > ones) and take a close look at the "gathering
followers" stuff.
> > It's
> > > crude, but it addresses an important part of
religion.
> >
> > A priest should also be able to preach to influence
a crowd
>
> Been there, done that-
>
> [ .5] A PRIEST CAN INFLUENCE THE THOUGHTS OF HIS
FOLLOWERS.
> A priest can perform a sermon to influence those that
follow
> his religion. If more than FIVE people attend his
sermon, only (50+
> [5%/Rank]%) people will stay to listen. For those that
stay 10%
> (+5%/Rank) can be converted. The chance for a priest
to convert a
> follower is (WP+[2%/Rank]%)
>
> I don't know if you've actually looked at it yet (and
if you
haven't,
> shame on you), but my Priest skill, if nothing else,
covers all the
> functions of a priest in as generic way as possible.
Everything
that
> follows the header (the mechanics and such) are
admittedly shaky,
but
> I think the headers, themselves, hold up pretty well.
I have read it, on many occasions, and posted my
thoughts in another
thread
David
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70 |
From: Richard <demon_star2002@y...>
Date: Thu Jun 19, 2003 10:30am
Subject:
Re: David's Draft Rules
|
|
|
--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
<david.barrass@e...> wrote:
> > I agree. I don't think MA should even be an issue
here.
>
> Ah, I do. As I've said the Priest uses his magic in
the name of the
> god. He therefore requires an MA to access the magic,
But the God
> makes it easier
LOL That's because, for some strange reason, we can't
both seem to
get in line with either Pagan or POL. My skill, for
instance, was
written with the POL in mind, before I even realized
there was one.
We should decide at some point to devote first to one,
then the
other. I leave the choice up to you.
> > Does this address the old POL vs. Magic issue?
>
> No, I was thinking of social acceptabillity between
Pagan religion
> and Magic. A big plus of a religion is that it allows
access to
> magic but with an acceptable moral face and code.
Therefore in
many
> societies mages will be seen as dangerous wild cards,
but a priest
> with the same abillities will be seen as a pillar of
society, he is
> more accountable. This is, of course culturally
dependant, and
will
> not be true of all a GM's nations and races.
And there should be something in your rules that
reiterates that idea.
Later,
R.
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71 |
From: Richard <demon_star2002@y...>
Date: Thu Jun 19, 2003 11:27am
Subject:
Re: Priest skill
|
|
|
--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
<david.barrass@e...> wrote:
> OK I'm taking this from the point of view of a Priest
of a Pagan
(for
> want of a better word, but anyway as opposed to PoL)
religion
Gotcha. I'll try to devote my energies to the Pagan side
until you
feel we've reached a stopping point. Keep in mind, too,
that this is
primarily a POL kinda priest I've done here. But I did
try to make it
as generic (for want of a better word) as possible.
>
> > [ .4] A PRIESTS BASE CHANCE OF SUCCESS FOR ALL ROLLS
INCREASES AS
> HE
> > GAINS FOLLOWERS.
> > The priest recieves +1%/4 followers he converts to
all
rolls.
>
> Interesting idea, one I have problems with, but I'm
not sure my
> objections are justified. I've been thinking about
this for some
> time and I'm still not sure. Who's followers are they,
the
priest's
> of the God's? How does this fit in with DQ mechanics?
But yes the
> diety will want to reward a successful priest. How
about 20 (or
> something like that, Exps reward from the Deity for
each sentient
> initiated as a reward (that brings up problems of what
happend if
the
> sentient decides he was wrong and leaves
The [+1%/4 followers] was just a guess. Is 4 followers
too small a
number? At higher rank (taking their ablities into
consideration)
that can add up to a really high bonus, I think. The
followers are
always those of the deity, never the priest. The more
people in the
community that worship that deity, the better off that
community
(especially the priests) is, courtesy of said deity. I
think this is
a very important aspect of any set of religion rules and
should be
strongly considered. Where it fits in with DQ mechanics
depends on
where and how this idea gets used. Just keep in mind
that experience
is experience is experience. A deity doesn't make
someone more
experienced, the actions of the priest/player do.
Getting exp bonuses
like that is, I think, unfair to the other players.
> > [ .5] A PRIEST CAN INFLUENCE THE THOUGHTS OF HIS
FOLLOWERS.
> > A priest can perform a sermon to influence those
that
follow
> > his religion. If more than FIVE people attend his
sermon, only
(50+
> > [5%/Rank]%) people will stay to listen. For those
that stay 10%
> > (+5%/Rank) can be converted. The chance for a priest
to convert a
> > follower is (WP+[2%/Rank]%)
>
> I was going to use the rules in Troubadour Bardic
Voice to charm,
it
> has already been worked out
This is meant to represent the people who want to become
part of the
priests religion. The arrow moves from the crowd toward
the priest,
not the other way around. In other words no one can make
you accept
the Mark of the Beast, if you get me. This is a part
that needs some
work. There are a lot of factors involved that aren't in
there, like
how people of other religions are affected, etc.
> > [ .7] AT RANK 5 A PRIEST MAY "LAY ON HANDS" AND HEAL
FOLLOWERS OF
> HIS
> > OWN RELIGION.
> > The priest performs this "laying on of hands" as a
Rank 3
> > Healer. All rules for this apply. See [59.1]
>
> No - sorry. This is not appropriate for, say, a priest
of an evil
or
> death god. I would suggest paying 3/4 exp cost for an
appropriate
> skill (if there is one) instead. This will be healling
for some
gods
Yeah, I was never really sure about this one. Yours
isn't the only
argument against it. Your suggestion works for me. :)
> > [ .9] A PRIEST MAY BE REQUIRED TO PERFORM A
SACRIFICE FOR HIS
DEITY.
> > Failure to do so gives the priest a -15% penalty as
[ .6]
> > above, as well as the required atonement.
>
> OK, but its a bit sketchy
Absolutely! lol Actually this was something that
would've been
covered more in each respective Mythos write up. Not
every religion
requires sacrifice, of course, so I left it
intentionally vague (too
vague, apparently)
> > [ .10] A PRIEST MUST SPEND (500x[Rank+number of
followers]) PER
> YEAR
> > FOR UPKEEP OF THE TEMPLE, AND THE TRAPPINGS AND
ACCOUTRAMENTS
> > APPROPRIATE TO THE RELIGION. IF NO TEMPLE EXISTS,
THE COST IS(100x
> > [Rank+number of followers] PER YEAR.
>
> OK that works, but for some points
> 1) I think its too expensive
Probably. Numbers have never been my strong point.
> 2) Its cheaper not to have a temple, so why would you
want a
temple?
> What are the advantages of a temple?
The same reason anyone wants a temple! I don't know why
ya need one,
I just know that they exist and do so in great
quantities all over
the world. Reason enough for me. Oh, I just thought of a
reason- that
whole "consecrated ground" business. There's your
advantage right
there.
> 3) You should be able to generate money from your
followers.
Agreed. A point I thoughtlessly glossed over. Waddaya
call it,
tithing?
> Perhaps the last point contains the solution to the
others, If you
> have a temple you get more donations from your
followers and you
> attract more followers
Works for me!
> > EXPERIENCE POINT COST CHART
> > 0 | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10
> > 75
|400|1600|3500|5800|8400|11400|14700|18500|22500|26750
>
> It seems expensive for what you get, especially if you
have to pay
> Exps for magical abillities, as you would in my
version.
>
> How about tieing increase in ranks to gaining
abillities, Rank 0
> tallents only, Rank 1 General Knowledge Abillities,
Rank 3 Can
start
> to learn the Special Knowledge.
Whatever works for ya. I don't believe I had a clue what
I was doing
when I wrote that part.
> This is my take on the skill as adapted to fit my
system. I hope I
> haven't destroyed you vision
Oh, hell no! Like I said, I feel like there was very
little worth
using, anyway. At least as far as the mechanics go. Do
with this as
you will. I'm curious what you'll come up with.
Later,
R.
|
|
|
72 |
From: dbarrass_2000 <david.barrass@e...>
Date: Fri Jun 20, 2003 1:41am
Subject:
Re: Priest skill
|
|
|
--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com, "Richard"
<demon_star2002@y...> wrote:
> --- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
> <david.barrass@e...> wrote:
> > OK I'm taking this from the point of view of a
Priest of a Pagan
> (for
> > want of a better word, but anyway as opposed to PoL)
religion
>
> Gotcha. I'll try to devote my energies to the Pagan
side until you
> feel we've reached a stopping point. Keep in mind,
too, that this
is
> primarily a POL kinda priest I've done here. But I did
try to make
it
> as generic (for want of a better word) as possible.
>
>
> >
> > > [ .4] A PRIESTS BASE CHANCE OF SUCCESS FOR ALL
ROLLS INCREASES
AS
> > HE
> > > GAINS FOLLOWERS.
> > > The priest recieves +1%/4 followers he converts to
all
> rolls.
> >
> > Interesting idea, one I have problems with, but I'm
not sure my
> > objections are justified. I've been thinking about
this for some
> > time and I'm still not sure. Who's followers are
they, the
> priest's
> > of the God's? How does this fit in with DQ
mechanics? But yes
the
> > diety will want to reward a successful priest. How
about 20 (or
> > something like that, Exps reward from the Deity for
each sentient
> > initiated as a reward (that brings up problems of
what happend if
> the
> > sentient decides he was wrong and leaves
>
> The [+1%/4 followers] was just a guess. Is 4 followers
too small a
> number? At higher rank (taking their ablities into
consideration)
> that can add up to a really high bonus, I think. The
followers are
> always those of the deity, never the priest. The more
people in the
> community that worship that deity, the better off that
community
> (especially the priests) is, courtesy of said deity. I
think this
is
> a very important aspect of any set of religion rules
and should be
> strongly considered. Where it fits in with DQ
mechanics depends on
> where and how this idea gets used. Just keep in mind
that
experience
> is experience is experience. A deity doesn't make
someone more
> experienced, the actions of the priest/player do.
Getting exp
bonuses
> like that is, I think, unfair to the other players.
OK I see your obections to the Exps bonus.
How do you define followers?
1) is it anyone friendly who just happens to be around
at the time
2) General beleivers
3) Initiates
4) People initiated by the priest
5) initiates who've made a personal commitment to the
priest
Is this personal power or is it a reward from the god to
an effective
servant?
All of these questions will influence the mechanics
> > > [ .5] A PRIEST CAN INFLUENCE THE THOUGHTS OF HIS
FOLLOWERS.
> > > A priest can perform a sermon to influence those
that
> follow
> > > his religion. If more than FIVE people attend his
sermon, only
> (50+
> > > [5%/Rank]%) people will stay to listen. For those
that stay 10%
> > > (+5%/Rank) can be converted. The chance for a
priest to convert
a
> > > follower is (WP+[2%/Rank]%)
> >
> > I was going to use the rules in Troubadour Bardic
Voice to charm,
> it
> > has already been worked out
>
> This is meant to represent the people who want to
become part of
the
> priests religion. The arrow moves from the crowd
toward the priest,
> not the other way around. In other words no one can
make you accept
> the Mark of the Beast, if you get me. This is a part
that needs
some
> work. There are a lot of factors involved that aren't
in there,
like
> how people of other religions are affected, etc.
My feeling was that the preaching was not to the
converted, but to
attract new followers. In which case the priest needs
something to
grab the attention of the people who'll drift away
Perhas there are two abillites here
1) Sermons - to bind belevers even more tightly to the
religion
2) Preaching - to attract more followers
In my rules initiates gain increased resistance to
charms of other
religions
> > > [ .7] AT RANK 5 A PRIEST MAY "LAY ON HANDS" AND
HEAL FOLLOWERS
OF
> > HIS
> > > OWN RELIGION.
> > > The priest performs this "laying on of hands" as a
Rank 3
> > > Healer. All rules for this apply. See [59.1]
> >
> > No - sorry. This is not appropriate for, say, a
priest of an
evil
> or
> > death god. I would suggest paying 3/4 exp cost for
an
appropriate
> > skill (if there is one) instead. This will be
healling for some
> gods
>
> Yeah, I was never really sure about this one. Yours
isn't the only
> argument against it. Your suggestion works for me. :)
>
> > > [ .9] A PRIEST MAY BE REQUIRED TO PERFORM A
SACRIFICE FOR HIS
> DEITY.
> > > Failure to do so gives the priest a -15% penalty
as [ .6]
> > > above, as well as the required atonement.
> >
> > OK, but its a bit sketchy
>
> Absolutely! lol Actually this was something that
would've been
> covered more in each respective Mythos write up. Not
every religion
> requires sacrifice, of course, so I left it
intentionally vague
(too
> vague, apparently)
OK
> > > [ .10] A PRIEST MUST SPEND (500x[Rank+number of
followers]) PER
> > YEAR
> > > FOR UPKEEP OF THE TEMPLE, AND THE TRAPPINGS AND
ACCOUTRAMENTS
> > > APPROPRIATE TO THE RELIGION. IF NO TEMPLE EXISTS,
THE COST IS
(100x
> > > [Rank+number of followers] PER YEAR.
> >
> > OK that works, but for some points
> > 1) I think its too expensive
>
> Probably. Numbers have never been my strong point.
>
> > 2) Its cheaper not to have a temple, so why would
you want a
> temple?
> > What are the advantages of a temple?
>
> The same reason anyone wants a temple! I don't know
why ya need
one,
> I just know that they exist and do so in great
quantities all over
> the world. Reason enough for me. Oh, I just thought of
a reason-
that
> whole "consecrated ground" business. There's your
advantage right
> there.
Yes that's true
> > 3) You should be able to generate money from your
followers.
>
> Agreed. A point I thoughtlessly glossed over. Waddaya
call it,
> tithing?
>
> > Perhaps the last point contains the solution to the
others, If
you
> > have a temple you get more donations from your
followers and you
> > attract more followers
>
> Works for me!
>
> > > EXPERIENCE POINT COST CHART
> > > 0 | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10
> > > 75
|400|1600|3500|5800|8400|11400|14700|18500|22500|26750
> >
> > It seems expensive for what you get, especially if
you have to
pay
> > Exps for magical abillities, as you would in my
version.
> >
> > How about tieing increase in ranks to gaining
abillities, Rank 0
> > tallents only, Rank 1 General Knowledge Abillities,
Rank 3 Can
> start
> > to learn the Special Knowledge.
>
> Whatever works for ya. I don't believe I had a clue
what I was
doing
> when I wrote that part.
>
> > This is my take on the skill as adapted to fit my
system. I hope
I
> > haven't destroyed you vision
>
> Oh, hell no! Like I said, I feel like there was very
little worth
> using, anyway. At least as far as the mechanics go. Do
with this as
> you will. I'm curious what you'll come up with.
Religions in some ways are easier than normal skills,
they seem to
wrap the increase of abillities in misteries and
ceremonies, fits in
nicely with a rank system.
David
|
|
|
73 |
From: <DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Wed Jun 25, 2003 5:55am
Subject:
New file uploaded to DragonQuestCathedral
|
|
|
Hello,
This email message is a notification to let you know
that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the
DragonQuestCathedral
group.
File : /Spirits and Religion V1.0.pdf
Uploaded by : dbarrass_2000 <david.barrass@e...>
Description : Spirits and religion Verson 1.0
You can access this file at the URL
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DragonQuestCathedral/files/Spirits%20and%20%20Religion%20V1.0.pdf
Regards,
dbarrass_2000 <david.barrass@e...>
|
|
|
74 |
From: dbarrass_2000 <david.barrass@e...>
Date: Wed Jun 25, 2003 6:01am
Subject:
Draft Rules V1
|
|
|
Hi all,
I've posted a new version of my rules for spirits and
religion.
Please have a look at it.
I tried to keep track of the changes made since the last
version, but
there were just too many, I did a complete overhaul.
I've changed
the section numbering to keep in line with Arcane
Wisdom.
Pleeeeease comment
David
|
|
|
75 |
From: Richard <demon_star2002@y...>
Date: Wed Jun 25, 2003 9:34am
Subject:
Re: Draft Rules V1
|
|
|
Sorry I couldn't get in any comments on your last
post before putting
your file up. Been busy, you know how it is.
Usually I like to print out stuff like this so I can go
over it at my
leisure, so it'll be a few days at least before I can
get any
comments to you. Two exceptions to that- you can go
ahead and put my
full name on there (Richard Butler), the other is
something I'd meant
to mention before and forgot. The term "non-magic
religion" always
chaffed me a bit. It feels like it's taking a back seat
to the
magical religions. I'm thinking something like "divine
religions",
but that sounds redundant somehow. Any thoughts there?
Did you get around to revising your Ego combat rules?
Have you had a
chance to play test it?
Later,
R.
--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
<david.barrass@e...> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I've posted a new version of my rules for spirits and
religion.
> Please have a look at it.
>
> I tried to keep track of the changes made since the
last version,
but
> there were just too many, I did a complete overhaul.
I've changed
> the section numbering to keep in line with Arcane
Wisdom.
>
> Pleeeeease comment
>
> David
|
|
|
76 |
From: dbarrass_2000 <david.barrass@e...>
Date: Wed Jun 25, 2003 9:45am
Subject:
Re: Draft Rules V1
|
|
|
--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com, "Richard"
<demon_star2002@y...> wrote:
> Sorry I couldn't get in any comments on your last post
before
putting
> your file up. Been busy, you know how it is.
Yes, I'm off to a conference in Vienna next week, so I
should have
been preparing for it, but you know how it is, but I
must get on with
it now
> Usually I like to print out stuff like this so I can
go over it at
my
> leisure, so it'll be a few days at least before I can
get any
> comments to you. Two exceptions to that- you can go
ahead and put
my
> full name on there (Richard Butler),
OK
> the other is something I'd meant
> to mention before and forgot. The term "non-magic
religion" always
> chaffed me a bit. It feels like it's taking a back
seat to the
> magical religions. I'm thinking something like "divine
religions",
> but that sounds redundant somehow. Any thoughts there?
Yes it is very clumsy. Some suggestions:-
Powers of Light Religion - even clumsier
Faith Religion - surely they all require faith
-oh dear I'm not very good at naming things I don't want
to use
anything too "christian"
> Did you get around to revising your Ego combat rules?
Have you had
a
> chance to play test it?
no and no, maybe I'll pick up the campain again once I'm
back from
Vienna
|
|
|
77 |
From: Richard <demon_star2002@y...>
Date: Wed Jun 25, 2003 9:55am
Subject:
Re: Priest skill
|
|
|
--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
<david.barrass@e...> wrote:
>
> How do you define followers?
> 1) is it anyone friendly who just happens to be around
at the time
No. They could be less inclined to incur the wrath of an
irate god,
however (as opposed to a race/group/family/whatever that
pissed off
the god). Depends on the religion.
> 2) General beleivers
> 3) Initiates
> 4) People initiated by the priest
> 5) initiates who've made a personal commitment to the
priest
Yes. Depends on what the religion called for. But for
the most part,
still yes.
> Is this personal power or is it a reward from the god
to an
effective
> servant?
The latter, but I suppose the priest could affect the
power with his
willpower, maybe.
> All of these questions will influence the mechanics
>
>
> > > > [ .5] A PRIEST CAN INFLUENCE THE THOUGHTS OF HIS
FOLLOWERS.
> > > > A priest can perform a sermon to influence those
that
> > follow
> > > > his religion. If more than FIVE people attend
his sermon,
only
> > (50+
> > > > [5%/Rank]%) people will stay to listen. For
those that stay
10%
> > > > (+5%/Rank) can be converted. The chance for a
priest to
convert
> a
> > > > follower is (WP+[2%/Rank]%)
> > >
> > > I was going to use the rules in Troubadour Bardic
Voice to
charm,
> > it
> > > has already been worked out
> >
> > This is meant to represent the people who want to
become part of
> the
> > priests religion. The arrow moves from the crowd
toward the
priest,
> > not the other way around. In other words no one can
make you
accept
> > the Mark of the Beast, if you get me. This is a part
that needs
> some
> > work. There are a lot of factors involved that
aren't in there,
> like
> > how people of other religions are affected, etc.
>
> My feeling was that the preaching was not to the
converted, but to
> attract new followers. In which case the priest needs
something to
> grab the attention of the people who'll drift away
I think I was simulating both with the above. The people
that walk
away are those that aren't interested or unconvinced.
The idea that a
god (via the priest) could directly influence
non-believers to become
believers is kind of a scary one. The choice to follow a
religion is,
of course, up to the individual. What I was trying to do
was break
down any odd group into the people who would stay and
those that
wouldn't, etc. by percentage. I think now that that
should have been
two seperate functions instead of one.
> Perhas there are two abillites here
> 1) Sermons - to bind belevers even more tightly to the
religion
> 2) Preaching - to attract more followers
In game terms, I don't know what #1 would accomplish. #2
was the
point of that part of the skill.
> In my rules initiates gain increased resistance to
charms of other
> religions
A good idea that should have been in there in some form
or another.
> > > > [ .7] AT RANK 5 A PRIEST MAY "LAY ON HANDS" AND
HEAL
FOLLOWERS
> OF
> > > HIS
> > > > OWN RELIGION.
> > > > The priest performs this "laying on of hands" as
a Rank
3
> > > > Healer. All rules for this apply. See [59.1]
> > >
> > > No - sorry. This is not appropriate for, say, a
priest of an
> evil
> > or
> > > death god. I would suggest paying 3/4 exp cost for
an
> appropriate
> > > skill (if there is one) instead. This will be
healling for
some
> > gods
> >
> > Yeah, I was never really sure about this one. Yours
isn't the
only
> > argument against it. Your suggestion works for me.
:)
> >
> > > > [ .9] A PRIEST MAY BE REQUIRED TO PERFORM A
SACRIFICE FOR HIS
> > DEITY.
> > > > Failure to do so gives the priest a -15% penalty
as
[ .6]
> > > > above, as well as the required atonement.
> > >
> > > OK, but its a bit sketchy
> >
> > Absolutely! lol Actually this was something that
would've been
> > covered more in each respective Mythos write up. Not
every
religion
> > requires sacrifice, of course, so I left it
intentionally vague
> (too
> > vague, apparently)
>
> OK
So... is that a "yea" or a "nay" on that one?
Hey, I was thinking about the percentage of Mages in the
world vs.
the percentage of Priests. I'm thinking both should be
relatively
small, but the Priests would ultimately outnumber the
Mages. Like you
said- it's easier than skills. Any thoughts?
Later,
R.
|
|
|
78 |
From: Richard <demon_star2002@y...>
Date: Wed Jun 25, 2003 10:05am
Subject:
Re: Draft Rules V1
|
|
|
--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
<david.barrass@e...> wrote:
> Yes it is very clumsy. Some suggestions:-
> Powers of Light Religion - even clumsier
> Faith Religion - surely they all require faith
> -oh dear I'm not very good at naming things I don't
want to use
> anything too "christian"
Hmmm, what about tossing aesthetics this time and go
with "Faith-
Based Religion" clunky, yes, but it does follow the
magnificently dry
text SPI was so fond of. I'd settle for "Faith
Religion", too.
> > Did you get around to revising your Ego combat
rules? Have you
had
> a
> > chance to play test it?
>
> no and no, maybe I'll pick up the campain again once
I'm back from
> Vienna
Vienna? You lucky bastard! Business or pleasure? Either
way, have
fun, and if you run into any trouble, just tell 'em
you're Canadian
like we do. :D
Later,
R.
|
|
|
79 |
From: dbarrass_2000 <david.barrass@e...>
Date: Thu Jun 26, 2003 1:45am
Subject:
Re: Draft Rules V1
|
|
|
--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com, "Richard"
<demon_star2002@y...> wrote:
> --- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
> <david.barrass@e...> wrote:
>
> > Yes it is very clumsy. Some suggestions:-
> > Powers of Light Religion - even clumsier
> > Faith Religion - surely they all require faith
> > -oh dear I'm not very good at naming things I don't
want to use
> > anything too "christian"
>
> Hmmm, what about tossing aesthetics this time and go
with "Faith-
> Based Religion" clunky, yes, but it does follow the
magnificently
dry
> text SPI was so fond of. I'd settle for "Faith
Religion", too.
lol. I'll think about it for a bit
> > > Did you get around to revising your Ego combat
rules? Have you
> had
> > a
> > > chance to play test it?
> >
> > no and no, maybe I'll pick up the campain again once
I'm back
from
> > Vienna
>
> Vienna? You lucky bastard! Business or pleasure?
Either way, have
> fun, and if you run into any trouble, just tell 'em
you're Canadian
> like we do. :D
business - a conference starts at 9am finishes 11pm for
5 days (I
think I'll skip some sessions)
I say I'm Scottish, it goes down better than admitting
I'm English
and I have lived in Scotland for over half my life now
:--)
David
|
|
|
80 |
From: dbarrass_2000 <david.barrass@e...>
Date: Thu Jun 26, 2003 1:53am
Subject:
Re: Priest skill
|
|
|
--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com, "Richard"
<demon_star2002@y...> wrote:
> --- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
> <david.barrass@e...> wrote:
> >
> > How do you define followers?
> > 1) is it anyone friendly who just happens to be
around at the time
>
> No. They could be less inclined to incur the wrath of
an irate god,
> however (as opposed to a race/group/family/whatever
that pissed off
> the god). Depends on the religion.
>
> > 2) General beleivers
> > 3) Initiates
> > 4) People initiated by the priest
> > 5) initiates who've made a personal commitment to
the priest
>
> Yes. Depends on what the religion called for. But for
the most
part,
I have had some thoughts - see Version 1. I was thinking
of deciples
in terms of number
> > Is this personal power or is it a reward from the
god to an
> effective
> > servant?
>
> The latter, but I suppose the priest could affect the
power with
his
> willpower, maybe.
Ok that means that range between the priest and
followers dosn't
matter
> > All of these questions will influence the mechanics
> >
> >
> > > > > [ .5] A PRIEST CAN INFLUENCE THE THOUGHTS OF
HIS FOLLOWERS.
> > > > > A priest can perform a sermon to influence
those that
> > > follow
> > > > > his religion. If more than FIVE people attend
his sermon,
> only
> > > (50+
> > > > > [5%/Rank]%) people will stay to listen. For
those that stay
> 10%
> > > > > (+5%/Rank) can be converted. The chance for a
priest to
> convert
> > a
> > > > > follower is (WP+[2%/Rank]%)
> > > >
> > > > I was going to use the rules in Troubadour
Bardic Voice to
> charm,
> > > it
> > > > has already been worked out
> > >
> > > This is meant to represent the people who want to
become part
of
> > the
> > > priests religion. The arrow moves from the crowd
toward the
> priest,
> > > not the other way around. In other words no one
can make you
> accept
> > > the Mark of the Beast, if you get me. This is a
part that needs
> > some
> > > work. There are a lot of factors involved that
aren't in there,
> > like
> > > how people of other religions are affected, etc.
> >
> > My feeling was that the preaching was not to the
converted, but
to
> > attract new followers. In which case the priest
needs something
to
> > grab the attention of the people who'll drift away
>
> I think I was simulating both with the above. The
people that walk
> away are those that aren't interested or unconvinced.
The idea that
a
> god (via the priest) could directly influence
non-believers to
become
> believers is kind of a scary one. The choice to follow
a religion
is,
> of course, up to the individual. What I was trying to
do was break
> down any odd group into the people who would stay and
those that
> wouldn't, etc. by percentage. I think now that that
should have
been
> two seperate functions instead of one.
>
> > Perhas there are two abillites here
> > 1) Sermons - to bind belevers even more tightly to
the religion
> > 2) Preaching - to attract more followers
>
> In game terms, I don't know what #1 would accomplish.
#2 was the
> point of that part of the skill.
OK two abillities was getting clumsy. I agree with you
that becoming
a follower of a religion is a personal choise.
> > In my rules initiates gain increased resistance to
charms of
other
> > religions
>
> A good idea that should have been in there in some
form or another.
>
> > > > > [ .7] AT RANK 5 A PRIEST MAY "LAY ON HANDS"
AND HEAL
> FOLLOWERS
> > OF
> > > > HIS
> > > > > OWN RELIGION.
> > > > > The priest performs this "laying on of hands"
as a
Rank
> 3
> > > > > Healer. All rules for this apply. See [59.1]
> > > >
> > > > No - sorry. This is not appropriate for, say, a
priest of an
> > evil
> > > or
> > > > death god. I would suggest paying 3/4 exp cost
for an
> > appropriate
> > > > skill (if there is one) instead. This will be
healling for
> some
> > > gods
> > >
> > > Yeah, I was never really sure about this one.
Yours isn't the
> only
> > > argument against it. Your suggestion works for me.
:)
> > >
> > > > > [ .9] A PRIEST MAY BE REQUIRED TO PERFORM A
SACRIFICE FOR
HIS
> > > DEITY.
> > > > > Failure to do so gives the priest a -15%
penalty as
> [ .6]
> > > > > above, as well as the required atonement.
> > > >
> > > > OK, but its a bit sketchy
> > >
> > > Absolutely! lol Actually this was something that
would've been
> > > covered more in each respective Mythos write up.
Not every
> religion
> > > requires sacrifice, of course, so I left it
intentionally vague
> > (too
> > > vague, apparently)
> >
> > OK
>
> So... is that a "yea" or a "nay" on that one?
not sure. I have sacrifices in my writes ups, but both
the priest
and diety beefit from it, rather than a penalty for not
doing it
> Hey, I was thinking about the percentage of Mages in
the world vs.
> the percentage of Priests. I'm thinking both should be
relatively
> small, but the Priests would ultimately outnumber the
Mages. Like
you
> said- it's easier than skills. Any thoughts?
Agreed - certainly in most civilisations I can hink of
David
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81 |
From: Richard <demon_star2002@y...>
Date: Fri Jun 27, 2003 9:13am
Subject:
Re: Priest skill
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--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
<david.barrass@e...> wrote:
> > > Is this personal power or is it a reward from the
god to an
> > effective
> > > servant?
> >
> > The latter, but I suppose the priest could affect
the power with
> his
> > willpower, maybe.
>
> Ok that means that range between the priest and
followers dosn't
> matter
I like the idea of a religion being, initially, at
least, tied to
it's area of origin and the priest's power being limited
to those
areas where there are followers. In other words, a
priest can't do
much good outside his community unless he gains more
followers there.
Incentive to actively gain more followers. This could
make the
travelling priest either really interesting or really
irritating to
play. If you want to stick to the D&D Cleric model, then
it would
probably be pretty irritating. As you know, I want to
get far, far
away from that.
I don't know how something like this would work
mechanically, but the
more I think about it, the more I like it.
> > So... is that a "yea" or a "nay" on that one?
>
> not sure. I have sacrifices in my writes ups, but both
the priest
> and diety beefit from it, rather than a penalty for
not doing it
Really, anything that would benefit a god would, in
turn, benefit the
priest and, in turn, the community. So we could just
look at anything
like that having a direct cause and effect on the
priest. Words to
this effect could be mentioned in the introductory text
for the skill
(or where ever all this is gonna end up).
> > Hey, I was thinking about the percentage of Mages in
the world
vs.
> > the percentage of Priests. I'm thinking both should
be relatively
> > small, but the Priests would ultimately outnumber
the Mages. Like
> you
> > said- it's easier than skills. Any thoughts?
>
> Agreed - certainly in most civilisations I can hink of
I mention this because it would influence the way people
see the both
of them. Religion, one may argue, is a way for Man to
explain the
unexplainable- it's all due to the will of the gods. The
Mage seeks
knowledge that explains the world in magical terms, but
that
knowledge is available to a very few amount of people.
That would tend to polarize Mages from the rest of the
community as
the common man doesn't have an explanation for what the
Mage can do
(again, I'm forgetting pagan religions here), and there
you have the
conflict of interests.
Okay, I'm through stating the obvious.
Later,
R.
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82 |
From: dbarrass_2000 <david.barrass@e...>
Date: Fri Jun 27, 2003 10:10am
Subject:
Re: Priest skill
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--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com, "Richard"
<demon_star2002@y...> wrote:
> --- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
> <david.barrass@e...> wrote:
> > > > Is this personal power or is it a reward from
the god to an
> > > effective
> > > > servant?
> > >
> > > The latter, but I suppose the priest could affect
the power
with
> > his
> > > willpower, maybe.
> >
> > Ok that means that range between the priest and
followers dosn't
> > matter
>
> I like the idea of a religion being, initially, at
least, tied to
> it's area of origin and the priest's power being
limited to those
> areas where there are followers. In other words, a
priest can't do
> much good outside his community unless he gains more
followers
there.
> Incentive to actively gain more followers. This could
make the
> travelling priest either really interesting or really
irritating to
> play. If you want to stick to the D&D Cleric model,
then it would
> probably be pretty irritating. As you know, I want to
get far, far
> away from that.
>
> I don't know how something like this would work
mechanically, but
the
> more I think about it, the more I like it.
Yes, it is an attractive idea. I'll give the mechanics
some thought
David
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83 |
From: Richard <demon_star2002@y...>
Date: Mon Jul 7, 2003 11:32am
Subject:
In case you were wondering...
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where I've been, I'm actually just waiting for your
next installment.
I don't think I have anything to add at this point.
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84 |
From: dbarrass_2000 <david.barrass@e...>
Date: Tue Jul 8, 2003 7:46am
Subject:
Re: In case you were wondering...
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--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com, "Richard"
<demon_star2002@y...> wrote:
> where I've been, I'm actually just waiting for your
next
installment.
> I don't think I have anything to add at this point.
I've been in Vienna; got back Sunday
Have you really no comments about the latest draft?
I notice I've made a mistake with the dimension portal
of Shamanism,
I'll correct it next draft
> I like the idea of a religion being, initially, at
least, tied to
> it's area of origin and the priest's power being
limited to those
> areas where there are followers. In other words, a
priest can't do
> much good outside his community unless he gains more
followers
there.
> Incentive to actively gain more followers. This could
make the
> travelling priest either really interesting or really
irritating to
> play. If you want to stick to the D&D Cleric model,
then it would
> probably be pretty irritating. As you know, I want to
get far, far
> away from that.
>
> I don't know how something like this would work
mechanically, but
the
> more I think about it, the more I like it.
As for your point about he power of a priest being more
tied to the
followers, how about one of the following:-
1) The priest must have face to face contact with his
followers to
gain the benefit
Or
2) The priest gains benefit from the congregation (1pt /
2 or 3
participants up to WP) of the last ceremony he
officiated in, this
benefit lasts a week
David
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85 |
From: Richard <demon_star2002@y...>
Date: Tue Jul 8, 2003 8:33am
Subject:
Re: In case you were wondering...
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--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
<david.barrass@e...> wrote:
>
> Have you really no comments about the latest draft?
Sorry about that. I'm in the middle of a lawsuit and
have to represent
myself, so I've been a little preoccupied. I'll print it
out and try
to give it the once over ASAP.
>
> As for your point about he power of a priest being
more tied to the
> followers, how about one of the following:-
>
> 1) The priest must have face to face contact with his
followers to
> gain the benefit
Hmmm That would mean to be really effective, the priest
would have to
have his flock tagging along all the time. Don't think
this one would
work well in the field.
> 2) The priest gains benefit from the congregation (1pt
/ 2 or 3
> participants up to WP) of the last ceremony he
officiated in, this
> benefit lasts a week
This is better. I'm interested in the the WP limit, but
wouldn't that
prevent the priest from become really powerful? I'm
thinking that the
priest should be fairly limited initially (in comparison
to the mage),
but gain power as he gains followers. Now that I think
about it,
followers could be the gauge by which we measure the
priests power,
replacing that whole "Piety" business.
The benefits should be cumulative and open ended, but
the process of
gaining followers should be a neccesarilly difficult
one.
Later,
R.
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86 |
From: dbarrass_2000 <david.barrass@e...>
Date: Tue Jul 8, 2003 9:47am
Subject:
Re: In case you were wondering...
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--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com, "Richard"
<demon_star2002@y...> wrote:
> --- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
> <david.barrass@e...> wrote:
>
> >
> > Have you really no comments about the latest draft?
>
> Sorry about that. I'm in the middle of a lawsuit and
have to
represent
> myself, so I've been a little preoccupied. I'll print
it out and try
> to give it the once over ASAP.
Oh - it sounds like you have better things to occupy
yourself with
> > As for your point about he power of a priest being
more tied to
the
> > followers, how about one of the following:-
> >
> > 1) The priest must have face to face contact with
his followers
to
> > gain the benefit
>
> Hmmm That would mean to be really effective, the
priest would have
to
> have his flock tagging along all the time. Don't think
this one
would
> work well in the field.
This is a development of what I was thinking of in the
priest skill,
and was ment to be read as an amentment to this
> > 2) The priest gains benefit from the congregation
(1pt / 2 or 3
> > participants up to WP) of the last ceremony he
officiated in,
this
> > benefit lasts a week
>
> This is better. I'm interested in the the WP limit,
but wouldn't
that
> prevent the priest from become really powerful? I'm
thinking that
the
> priest should be fairly limited initially (in
comparison to the
mage),
> but gain power as he gains followers. Now that I think
about it,
> followers could be the gauge by which we measure the
priests power,
> replacing that whole "Piety" business.
>
> The benefits should be cumulative and open ended, but
the process of
> gaining followers should be a neccesarilly difficult
one.
See my ideas on this in the latest version - but don't
do this if
its at the expence of your law suit
I think WP is a good practical limit. Say a priest has
15, that's a
potential + 15 to all priestly skill chances, this is
pritty handy,
he can alway increase his WP to 20ish giving a nice +20
to all skill
rolls. I'm thinking here of close personal followers,
and I think
there is a limit to how many a priest can have, Jesus,
for example
(yes he would be POL but still...) only had 12 :--)
David
PS - good luck with the law suit
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87 |
From: Richard <demon_star2002@y...>
Date: Thu Jul 10, 2003 10:44am
Subject:
In the meantime...
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I was thinking about "lesser" skills, the ones that
mostly just add
color to a character. I'd seen some rules that involve
expenditure of
XP and might have involved rank (can't recall).
So, I'm thinking that seems like too much trouble for
Basketweaving
or Fishing or whatever and remembered how the lesser
skills of
Troubador, for instance are performed "masterfully" or
"competently"
or something like that without the need for a role.
So, why not just take a skill like that, no XP involved,
and be able
to perform it well? Okay, maybe like 1 XP per skill and
an
appropriate char. roll or something, depending on the
skill.
Just a thought.
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88 |
From: dbarrass_2000 <david.barrass@e...>
Date: Fri Jul 11, 2003 10:21am
Subject:
Re: In the meantime...
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This is probably better discussed in
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dq-rules/
but its your group so I guess you can open up what ever
can of worms
you want
Most skill rolls are not automatic, requiring a default
90+rank roll,
so how about that?
For ExP cost haw about a multiple, easy to start with,
dificult to
master (eg 2xExp multile to get rank 0 as starting is
always more
difficult). This has the advantage that you only need to
think up
one number.
As for cost there are some "mundane skills" in the DQ
book, for
example troubadour's play instrument, amuse etc. He pays
500Exps to
gain more abillities at rank 10 and a courtisan 1000 to
gain similar
abillities. Probably the diference in cost is due to
training
availability. Both probably have a "bulk discount" and
so the cost
will be about 1000-2000Exps to gain rank 10 in a mundane
skill.
Hanging on by my fingernails here
so an Experience multiple would be somewhere in the
region of 18 to 35
Does this make sense?
I came up with this in responce to postings in rules
asking about
splitting off subskills from DQ main skills, but that
thread died
before I could post it.
David
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89 |
From: dbarrass_2000 <david.barrass@e...>
Date: Mon Aug 11, 2003 3:26am
Subject:
Any Feedback?
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Hi everyone,
Does anyone have anything to say about my ideas?
Any feedback apreciated
David
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90 |
From: Richard <demon_star2002@y...>
Date: Mon Aug 11, 2003 10:52am
Subject:
Re: Any Feedback?
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I'm still here, brother! I've just had lots of
different stuff
(including other games) get in the way. I promise I'll
read your new
version and let you know what I think.
Later,
R.
--- In
DragonQuestCathedral@yahoogroups.com,
"dbarrass_2000"
<david.barrass@e...> wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
> Does anyone have anything to say about my ideas?
>
> Any feedback apreciated
>
> David
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